imho (not that it matters to you lot) I'm not very goth but newer musick would bring me out ie faith in chaos I've heard a ton of drum and bass rmx work on goth tunes and really just new stuff that I've never heard of and more on the electric side of things
I'm sure that so much is going on in the goth scene and here we only get a small look into whats going on in the rest of the world !












just my 2c

yeah i mean if we are goin out side the spectrum of just pure depressing ass goth music then my line up would probably look like this



kid 606
venetian snares
doormouse
enduser
bong-ra
tech itch
ec8or
a.r.e. weapons
audio bullies
nazi's from mars
chicks on speed
le tigre
somatic responses
needle sharing
edgey
then probably some dirty south hip hop track really screwed and chopped to end the set

Bone wrote:Does popularity of a band such as say Evanescense negate the goth factor? Listen to their whole CD folks - that band is gother than than most most of the "goth" bands currently coming out. But due to their popular radio air play and having several songs on the top 40 many will say they don't belong in a goth night

I don't think it matters at all if a band is mainstream in determining whether that band is "goth" (After all the Cure is pretty mainstream, no? And tons of people classify them as goth). I think it should be about the way the band sounds and the vibe they give off etc. I personally would not want to hear Evanescence because I dislike Amy Lee's voice. However I think the guy who does the keyboards is amazing and I would really love it if he would get together with a different vocalist. I think the sound he creates is very beautiful, atmospheric, mysterious, and dark and I would definately qualify at least his part as goth.
Anyway, the bands I see as both goth or compatible with the goth vibe, as well as being good musically, are:

Razor Skyline
Switchblade Symphony
Hungry Lucy
Battery
Skinny Puppy
Diary of Dreams
Wolfsheim
Ohgr
Suicide Commando
Claire Voyant
Frontline Assembly
Revolting Cocks
Siouxsie and the Banshees
Miranda Sex Garden
Apoptygma Berzerk
Marilyn Manson
Fields of the Nephilim
Sisters of Mercy
(some) Collide
This Ascension
Clan of Xymox (at least the early stuff)
Thoushaltnot
KMFDM
Icon of Coil
L'ame Immortelle
Faith and the muse
Cocteau Twins (not too Dancey though)

a lot of the bands you listed aren't "goth" at all

some of them are industrial

and i'm not quite sure why people continue to link the two
they are completely seperate beasts

rec|use wrote:a lot of the bands you listed aren't "goth" at all

some of them are industrial

and i'm not quite sure why people continue to link the two
they are completely seperate beasts

That is why I said this:
"Anyway, the bands I see as both goth or compatible with the goth vibe"
I know they're not all goth, but I hear some overlap between the two genres (and often people combine the two) and to me the vibes of the two genres go well together.

yeah i just don't see how throbbing gristle and the cure equate
as the same vibe
but what ever

I did not even mention the cure or throbbing gristle in my list, nor did i say goth and industrial were the "same"

Also I refer you to a great quote from Bone in this thread:

Bone wrote:the term "goth" when refering to music is a rather loose one that can incompass a lot of different music styles, from the Misfits (punk) to Dead Can Dance (Celtic Folk)... Everyone will have a different idea of what goth is.

Couldn't have said it better myself

i didn't say you didsay or list any of that
a. i was using throbbing gristle and the cure as generic poster boys for the genres

and
b. i'm not argueing with you
i just don't feel the genre's are related



as far as bone's quote

that means absolutely nothing to me

i don't follow the trend of half of this board
of lumping all subcultures under the name "goth"

in fact i think it's absurd



the misfits are a punk band
and front line assembly are an industrial band

rec|use wrote:you people
stop calling johnny cash goth

he was the man in black for a reason
not because he was mad at daddy and wanted to be a vampire

I don't know why, but thats the funniest thing I've read all day.

rec|use wrote:i didn't say you didsay or list any of that
a. i was using throbbing gristle and the cure as generic poster boys for the genres

and
b. i'm not argueing with you
i just don't feel the genre's are related



as far as bone's quote

that means absolutely nothing to me

i don't follow the trend of half of this board
of lumping all subcultures under the name "goth"

in fact i think it's absurd



the misfits are a punk band
and front line assembly are an industrial band

i am with rec on this one. there are a few bands that bridge generas, like Bauhaus for example. (punk/goth)

but most of it you can't.

but if you lump everything together as "goth" then you are calling Einstürzende Neubauten gothic. and no. you just can't do that.

Some one should ask Mick Mercer....since his is the only opinion that matters on what is goth........as far as he is concerned.

Well....Six CD's and several books makes him an authority....Right?


On the other hand....he only considerd true Goth to be the outshoot of Punk scene.

That means:
Bauhaus
Red lorry yellow lorry
Alien Sex Fiend
Rosetta Stone
Creaming Jesus
Gene Loves Jezebel
Marionettes
Die Lady Di
Inkubus Sukkubus
Brix Smith
and other classics bands available from Cleopatra recording.


I would never go to such a night though.....because the music would suck.....In my opinion. I hate the "True" goth style...though I do like some of the things that sprung out of it when they merged with other styles from places other than New York.


That is the rub though....as Shadow stated...we all go to club nights because our friends are there....and/or...the drinks are big and/or cheap (for those that drink, anyway). Some go for the fashion show....some go just because it feels good to be there.
Some are looking for true love.....pity them though. None of which has to do with the music played.....probably why the whole Temple thing seems to be doing so well.

This thread has given me some interesting ideas on new (and old) music to look into though.

I have been focusing on the Asleep By Dawn magazine though....for new things.....after a while...even the best music gets old and boring. And there is SO much out there to listen to.

Like Duke Ellington once said "If it sounds good....then it IS good."

and as I always add......"even if that is only for you."


OK...I'll shut up now.
.

celticsmith wrote:we all go to club nights because our friends are there....and/or...the drinks are big and/or cheap (for those that drink, anyway). Some go for the fashion show....some go just because it feels good to be there.
Some are looking for true love.....pity them though.

i go because i want to bitch about crappy music.

karmakaze wrote: there are a few bands that bridge generas,

but most of it you can't.

I disagree with that. Maybe when the genres originated they were one or another but many bands since the origin use some of this, some of that. I hear these combinations in the following bands:

*Switchblade Symphony: goth, ethereal, trip-hop, industrial, pop, classical or neo-classical, opera
*Hungry Lucy: ethereal, goth, pop, industrial, classical and something else that i dont know the name of
*Razor Skyline: Ethereal, Goth, and Industrial
*Skinny Puppy: hard to classify as many bands are but has elements of industrial, experimental and goth
*Collide: goth, industrial, ethereal, and something else difficult to name
*Wolfsheim: EBM/Synthpop and goth
*Ohgr- I have no idea but I hear some goth, pop and industrial influence in there
*Battery: goth and industrial
*L'ame Immortelle- goth, ethereal, ebm, industrial
*diary of dreams: goth and EBM
*Frontline Assembly: mainly industrial but has some "eerie" sounds that remind me of goth

Not that any of that perfectly describes the bands sound or is an all inclusive list, just a general idea.

but if you lump everything together as "goth" then you are calling Einstürzende Neubauten gothic. and no. you just can't do that.

True, though I dont know anyone who says that.
If someone asked me what kind of music EN was, I would certainly not say "goth" but if someone asked me if it would be fitting to play EN at a goth event, i would say definately. Of course thats a subjective issue though.

tat2jay wrote:just for that i am never playing Disturbed at temple while you are there ever again

That's fine with me, no one else likes it but me anyway, so why appeal to one person, when you can appeal to the masses.

all you did was slap the word goth in front of a buch of other genre names

no, i posted what i hear

i think you need to do some more research

ok, please tell me what the authority on genres is

the internet is a good tool
online zines
paper publications

maybe a music history class

those would be usefull

Yes i know internet sites etc. but surely not just any internet site or publication is an authority on genres, I mean what is a specific website, online zine, etc. that you would recommend? And I dont know of any music history classes that cover these bands or genres (except classical , opera and pop) but if you know of any I'd be very interested in taking one.
If you know more about it than me, perhaps you can direct me to the sites and publications and classes from which you got your knowledge.