Russo wrote:

Hardcoregirl wrote:

junkie christ wrote:there needs to be an option for believe certain translations are real but the king james version is over edited and changed for content worse than the rest.

Have you ever seen that bumper sticker that says

If it ain't king james, it ain't bible
'


I can't believe that sort of stupidity exists on this earth....
they must actually think it was originally in english!!

Come on, everyone knows American is God's language!

these are the same idiots that thing God is white and a republican.

Seraphim wrote:Was an atheist , now I am not. Not trying to stir any waves. I bellieve because of three things

1. Faith
2. Experience
3. Research

I am allowed to my beliefs even if you do not agree, just like you have your beliefs, and I have to respect that. So please do not tell me that I see what I want to see, because you have not given me any basis to believe otherwise. K !

Just to make sure you understand, I was not trying to be insulting or degrading to your beliefs at all so i hope that my comment did not offend you. I meant it a bit more broadly than I worded it. I was by no means saying that you are a good person solely because of your religious convictions.

In fact i agree with your quoted statement and try to live by that as well.

Hardcoregirl wrote:

Seraphim wrote:Historic and Scientific , to completely back it up ! There is more concrete proof for God then against. Maybe a lame reason to some for believing as I know faith is the major factor, howver all of us have a choice to believe what you want and choose your path. God is extending an invatation and you can refuse it if you want the choice is yours.

There is no more proof for the existence of god than there is proof against the existence of god. You are just choosing to see what you want to see and believe what you want to believe.

Well, while disproving the existance of a god/supernatural force is not possible with current technology, there is certainly plenty of evidence that the xian bible if taken literally is wrong, and there is plenty of evidence that a god is unlikely to exist.

Actually, that's the good thing about xian literalists - there are so many demonstrable errors in the xian bible that it's obvious they're full of shit.

Even their "jesus" character is so similar to other savior characters in other religious myths, and the historical evidence of the "jesus" character is so weak, it's unlikely that "jesus" ever existed as anything but a myth.

Sorry you feel that way, but you still have not given me anything credible. I think I'll trust the people with their PHD and their Doctorate who are specialists in their chosen field and have studied all their life. Your opinion is your opinion . In fact new evidence turns up everyday disproving what was thought to be fact. Until I meet someone who has all the answers, why would I listen to them anyway. We have been on the moon ,but have never been to the very bottom of the ocean. I tell you what if you can tell every answer to every question in the universe, if you absoulutlely can tell me your are all knowing and know everything there is to know then I would listen. Until then your opinion is just that. give me some crdible evidence, instead of obtuse ramblings and potty mouth language. In fact give it your best shot, test me and all i give you all the evidence you need.

Get real and grow up !

Seraphim wrote: I think I'll trust the people with their PHD and their Doctorate who are specialists in their chosen field and have studied all their life.

Why would you trust someone more because they have a fucking piece of paper? This doesn't mean that they are more intelligent than anyone else. Seriously, think about this one. Even if they've studied the subject their whole lives, people are still just...people... Their "knowledge" of the topic isn't magically valid just because they stayed in school a few years longer.

Your opinion is your opinion .

If this is really what you think, then why not just let them state their opinions without dubbing them as "obtuse" and, oh shit, did you ACTUALLY call them "potty-mouthed", or am I hallucinating?! Are you trying to say your views are NOT opinions?

You just proved my point, so the basis of this whole topic is pointless, because we could debate until we are blue in the face. Each of us coming up with a million reasons why our points, our opinions are valid, none of us know everything there is to know. Everyone is allowed to their opinions does not make it fact !
Yes, my opinion is just that, you should not take as truth , you have to find that for yourself. I went a bit to far with the obtuse thing. Vader is highly intelligent and I would rather see his viewpoint, than the ramblings that prove or say nothing. As for the potty mouth thing, I feel it is not needed, especially in an intelligent conversation. Cursing makes intelligent people look stupid, even if their not.

OK, have some links.

http://www.vexen.co.uk/religion/christi ... jesus.html

http://www.atheists.org/christianity/didjesusexist.html

http://www.nobeliefs.com/exist.htm

http://home.inu.net/skeptic/exist.html

Plenty of scholarly work has been done on this, and a google search will turn up more of it. I don't have the time to rehash all of it here, but it is out there.

I will read these sites and try to see where you are coming from, this will help me respect your view more. In fact I am not downing your view by any means this is what I wanted, instead of random insults with no cerdible proof to back them up. I have friends of other faiths. In fact two of my close friends are buddhists. they share their faith with me, and I share mine with them, but we do not force it down each others throats. I am going to read your sites right now !

I have to say my main reason for sharing the bit of info I started with in this thread, is the cultural crossection. Basically, seeing how ones regional and econmical upbring or influence can vary the dept of one's faith in their religion.

Sorry, I just find the psychology of it fascinating. The point here isn't if or not the bible should be literally taken as the word of god. Obviously there are varied beliefs and no one really has the complete proof any of them are right, It's more a matter of scientific mind vs faith. No arguement here can be honestly won.
The point is what social groups believe within our country. You can further cross referance things like democratic vs republican ares and start seeing the larger mind set of an area and what influences it.

I just find it interesting.... maybe it's too much Asimov during my teen years.

Bone wrote:<snip>maybe it's too much Asimov </snip!>

there. is. no. such. thing.

Most of the scholarly efforts on BOTH sides come off to me as half-cocked.
I have Faith in God And also in Jesus as Saviour.
On the topic of "Well, the Bible was "Written" by Man"/"Too many Transcriptions/Translations"/etc....
OF COURSE it was "penned by man"
God Uses many tools to perform his will... Man is one of them.
Regarding "Translations"...
There are a few GREAT Jokes to be told, but, i n REALITY, as Modern scientists and Translators go back over the Ancient texts they are finding more accuracy than inaccuracy, by 99+%.
Many Modern "Bible-Thumping Christians" have problems with MisInterpretations or "Cherry-Picking", but the FACTS, as presented, are checking out more and more the more "study by independent scientists" is done.
I disagree with ALOT that Paul has to say in his "Letters", BUT those letters are simply letters... NOT something to be taken Literally or Not Literally.
Some parts are PRESENTED as "The Word of God"... Some parts are not.
I just HATE to see people "Bandwagon" on the "Translation/Transcription" issue without actually having a frickin' CLUE.

http://www.leestrobel.com/

http://www.josh.org/

http://gotquestions.org/

http://www.christiananswers.net/archaeology/

http://www.creationism.org/

Thank you, you stated it much better than I. Yes, the King James Version is a medival translation. The orginal is the greek, hebrew, and aramaic. I read the Holman Christian Standard which is translated from the orginals in todays english.

P.S. Michael, has anyone ever told you, you look like David Bowie ?

Seraphim wrote:P.S. Michael, has anyone ever told you, you look like David Bowie ?

Thanks...

Bible History

http://www.creationism.org/

Christian Holidays Pagan Festivals

http://www.comereason.org/soc_culture/soc030.asp

Probability

http://www.hopeofisrael.net/probability.htm

This whole post is more proof that people have always been and will always be arguing over religion. So why don't we just all agree to disagree and shut the fu** up instead of trying to out-link each other.
I feel like I'm in an elementary classroom with the kids shooting spitballs at each other.
SO STOP IT ALREADY!!!!!

Lady A wrote:So why don't we just all agree to disagree and shut the fu** up instead of trying to out-link each other.

because it's human nature to yammer and natter about what one believes (or doesn't believe) in.

listening in on, or reading, a debate on the topic can be quite educational, however, and as long as people aren't being cocks about it and devolve into name-calling, threatening, or fire-bombing each other over the subject, it's almost harmless.

iblis wrote: or fire-bombing each other over the subject, it's almost harmless.

Well...take all my fun out of it...



* moves on to the next thread *