My opinions on the current brouhaha over our Black Ball

Nexxus23 · Post by **Nexxus23** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 11:14 am

Jumpin' Jiminy Jehosephat.

Go or don't go. It really is that simple.

ReddErin · Post by **ReddErin** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 11:28 am

ophelia wrote:(quote ReddErin) 08-12-2002 -I don't feel that anyone needs the collective "our" approval for anything (Sanctus DJs or KG Board or KG members) before starting it, BUT it would have been polite to let us know in advance, at the very least. We all can't be polite, though, can we?

I don't know, can we? It's your advice, from not so long ago.

You missed my point, there. The last sentence was sarcasm...coming from me....about being polite...get it now?

I think that there was a discussion going on at the time about, "How can Fiction start a goth night without KG approval?" This was one of my responses, that if they wanted to do a goth night, they probably should have contacted us ahead of time. The reason, as you see I stated, was not that they had to ask permission, but that they could have utilized KG as free advertising and market research. The last point was made somewhere, but I'm not sure that it was posted in that particular thread.

Everyone was up in arms about getting KG approval. I never thought that anyone needed approval for a club night. I just thought that it was stupidity not to get some input from the goths before announcing it...for the owner's benefit and for the people. It was originally going to be a fetish night and was advertised as such. When the owner realized that people didn't want it to be a goth fetish night, he left that alone. Still, it went out on flyers. But, they aren't open anymore, are they? They didn't listen when given advice and ended up making it something like a hip-hop night because people didn't come. One instance, it took almost a month to get rid of the paid dancers, with everyone saying how stupid they thought that was. This could have all been avoided if the owner had spoken to the group first.

No, I didn't speak to the group. I did promotions for Sanctus for over a year....for free. I also did this website for longer than that....for free. I don't need to ask anyone what they want, as I have heard it for a long time now....we want a Saturday night. If you don't, don't support it. If we don't have enough people to support it, it won't happen. We're putting on the party. You're all invited. It does have admission. And, yes, the forum is still...everyone say it together....invitation only. Thanks.

JaNell · Post by **JaNell** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 11:30 am

Seraph Antaine wrote:
Codeine Coma wrote:To whom it may concern....

My previous post was not ment to slam DJ's.If it was taken this way,Forgive me.

I understand where the local DJ's come from...And yes I did support them.(I currently do not because of illnesses.But,if you need my support send me some of your original material and I will pay for it.)
As far as the Black Ball goes...I just want to open people's eyes to what I perceive is going on. And that is...another forum wants you to attend thier function...Yet,in previous statements they have clearly stated that some of you/us are not welcomed. And in previous other statements some added "Why would you want to go,if you were not invited?".

So I have one question for the "other forum"...Why are we all of a sudden deciding to invite all? You say it is not the money...Then tell me what it is? You previously stated that some were not welcomed....So why are they now?

Are you feeling OK? One more time...
The the private forum which may not be named forum is invitation only. Why? So we will have only members who are friends with at least someone on the board. That way, you do not get all the walk-in jackasses, trolling and flaming away, for whom no one can account. This is the only way we can think of to have a board that does not need moderators, something we are quite tired of. The initial list of invitees was limited to people whom we know and like, but was not inclusive of everyone we know and like. Those first members have the right to invite whomever they wish to add to our roster. In turn, the new members invited by them may invite whomever they wish. Whaddya know, it works! We don't have much time wasted in bickering on our board. We can use the time to actually get things done, like the planning of events. Events...
Stay with me buddy. Do you need some oxygen? The event we have organized on the private forum which may not be named has never been invitation-only. Never was anyone told they were not welcome to come. Interestingly, the KGB itself had no problem with our forum, until we announced we had arranged an event without consulting them. Laughable, that, especially in consideration of the fact that two of them are among the first registered members of our board. I guess the Bone being picked here is over who is collecting the cover at the door. There is no sudden change in that we are now inviting all. You do not have to invite people to an open party. You just tell them it is happening. The event, if you can read a flyer, is open to all adults, of at least 18yrs age. If, on the night of Saturday the 27th, you feel that you should abstain from fun, in order to show that you wish only to support KG, rather than support a widening scene, then, by all means stay at home, or go down to Liquid and spend your money there. Or go out of town and patronize someone else's scene. I do not care really what your decision will ultimately be. It is the basis, or fallacy, upon which you decide which bothers me, and that only slightly. I do not know you, and would not recognize you if you showed up. And if you do not show, I will not miss seeing you. There will be many people there whom I will not know, and I doubt any of them will enjoy themselves one bit less for not being a member of the the private forum which may not be named forum.

That answer was a strategic error for many reasons, Tony.

"Or go out of town and patronize someone else's scene."
I was going to PM you about this subject, since I had more thoughts on it, but since you mentioned it, I'll address it here.
The reasons for the raids, from what I've heard:
Meet new people.
Recruit out-of-town people to come play with us in Knoxville.
Get the heck out of Knoxville. Much as I like Knoxville, it gets claustrophobic and everyone needs to get a vacation from it every once in a while.
Roadtrip!

None of those reasons will change if we have a weekly night - a weekly night would be lovely.

I also have some issues with your problems with Ivy's - especially since you were one of the original people going to Skareoke. Ivy's was a dive that usually had a few random rednecks at the bar - so what? The Mercury was a dive, too. I didn't mind sharing club space with rednecks or random people who came in. Some of those people are on the board now. In fact, by the general definition of "Redneck" - which can include people who are rabid sports fans, have high school level education, live in a trailer, like wrestling, race cars or bikes - a lot of people on the board, people that I enjoy the company of, are Rednecks.

Ultimately, I can't support the private forum which may not be named because the private forum which may not be named doesn't support me. As far as I know, the money from Sanctus goes to support the servers and upgrades to keep the KG board going, as well as paying rent on the venues. I'll pay $5 to dance for that diversity. I also should point out that I am not a KG lapdog - I've felt pretty hung out to dry by the KG more than once. I do, however, believe firmly in the original ideal (not idea) of the board - to build a diverse community, an inclusive community, not dependant on your income, or social class, or who has a petty grudge against you.

Where will the money for the private forum which may not be named functions be going? EZ board is free, so it's not going to support the ability to host a board, which, of course, it would make no sense to support even if it did if all the people contributing financially aren't welcome on the board itself. I'd feel exactly the same way if it were a club or board that I qualified for; it's just the principle of the thing.

ophelia · Post by **ophelia** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 11:50 am

You missed my point, there. The last sentence was sarcasm...coming from me....about being polite...get it now?

I think that there was a discussion going on at the time about, "How can Fiction start a goth night without KG approval?" This was one of my responses, that if they wanted to do a goth night, they probably should have contacted us ahead of time. The reason, as you see I stated, was not that they had to ask permission, but that they could have utilized KG as free advertising and market research. The last point was made somewhere, but I'm not sure that it was posted in that particular thread.

Everyone was up in arms about getting KG approval. I never thought that anyone needed approval for a club night. I just thought that it was stupidity not to get some input from the goths before announcing it...for the owner's benefit and for the people. It was originally going to be a fetish night and was advertised as such. When the owner realized that people didn't want it to be a goth fetish night, he left that alone. Still, it went out on flyers. But, they aren't open anymore, are they? They didn't listen when given advice and ended up making it something like a hip-hop night because people didn't come. One instance, it took almost a month to get rid of the paid dancers, with everyone saying how stupid they thought that was. This could have all been avoided if the owner had spoken to the group first.

No, I didn't speak to the group. I did promotions for Sanctus for over a year....for free. I also did this website for longer than that....for free. I don't need to ask anyone what they want, as I have heard it for a long time now....we want a Saturday night. If you don't, don't support it. If we don't have enough people to support it, it won't happen. We're putting on the party. You're all invited. It does have admission. And, yes, the forum is still...everyone say it together....invitation only. Thanks.

I haven't missed your points. And I am not waging war on your forum or your club night. It doesn't affect my life that much. As far as Sinister goes, I am aware of every aspect of it, since Chris and I have been living together and collaborating from the get-go. There are much bigger issues (leading to its demise) that most people aren't aware of. And Chris and I made it a point to support every other venue, even as I was helping pull a couple of KG knives out of his back. There was no permission asked because there was no time allowed to us by Gary. Period. And our hands were obviously tied in regards to dancers, etc. (And yes, you did promote heavily for Sanctus, even at Sinister, which we were more than happy to let you do).

Saturday night is great. Admission is an obvious factor. What you are failing to understand is that private groups usually promote private functions. Frat parties are for the members, girl scout parties are for the girl scouts. You know as well as everyone that the new forum is not meant to remove drama. You wanted some, you started some. Kudos to you. I think it's all terribly amusing. And please don't think this has anything to do with my being a non-member of the private forum which may not be named, because I really don't care. There was a point when I would have danced on the burning ashes of KnoxGothic. But it doesn't hit that close to home anymore.

I wish you the best in all of your efforts, and that is not sarcasm. However, you have planted a seed, and you are getting the desired results, so why bother to come to this board and post at all? Why be so defensive? If you really don't give a shit, then don't. Host your night, give everyone the finger. I don't understand the point. You are obviously happy in the new niche, why continue the animosity. It's there- good job.

junkie christ · Post by **junkie christ** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:07 pm

all these major world issues right now
debates on great music right now
people reading and discussing new viewpoints on existance
the cali debates (which IS relevant considering that state pulls down 25% of the nations income, they get fucked, we get fucked)
people trying to start movements to help the lonely and the deprived
people feeding needy and hungry people, and using discussion systems like this one
people spending time with loved ones
reading a book
learning a new skill
finding out more about a god they are interested in.
searching for some deeper meaning in existence
making music, writing a book, ect
ectectect
SEE WHERE IM GOING WITH THIS? THIS WHINING OVER SOME PEOPLE THAT WANT TO THROW AN EVENT SHOW HOW FUCKING SHALLOW PEOPLE CAN BE.
SOMETIMES DEMOCRACY MAKES ME SICK. but not as sick as the people who graze over a disclaimer to the stupidity that becomes "scene menatlity".
last time im posting in this thread i think.. i hope.
see you guys at saturdays event, where people that hated the idea of the private forum which may not be named and their ball will be there because at the end of the day, this scene exists because theres a group of people that have things in common with you that everywhere else you go... you differ from the people your around.
goddamn it people, take a shit, drink a beer, and shut the fuck up. DO YOU NOT REALIZE YOU SHOULD BE THANKING THE PEOPLE??? WE HAVE ANOTHER EVENT NOW!
THATS A GOOD THING!
ARE YOU BLIND?
argh.

ophelia · Post by **ophelia** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:11 pm

junkie christ wrote:all these major world issues right now
debates on great music right now
people reading and discussing new viewpoints on existance
the cali debates (which IS relevant considering that state pulls down 25% of the nations income, they get fucked, we get fucked)
people trying to start movements to help the lonely and the deprived
people feeding needy and hungry people, and using discussion systems like this one
people spending time with loved ones
reading a book
learning a new skill
finding out more about a god they are interested in.
searching for some deeper meaning in existence
making music, writing a book, ect
ectectect
SEE WHERE IM GOING WITH THIS? THIS WHINING OVER SOME PEOPLE THAT WANT TO THROW AN EVENT SHOW HOW FUCKING SHALLOW PEOPLE CAN BE.
SOMETIMES DEMOCRACY MAKES ME SICK. but not as sick as the people who graze over a disclaimer to the stupidity that becomes "scene menatlity".
last time im posting in this thread i think.. i hope.
see you guys at saturdays event, where people that hated the idea of the private forum which may not be named and their ball will be there because at the end of the day, this scene exists because theres a group of people that have things in common with you that everywhere else you go... you differ from the people your around.
goddamn it people, take a shit, drink a beer, and shut the fuck up. DO YOU NOT REALIZE YOU SHOULD BE THANKING THE PEOPLE??? WE HAVE ANOTHER EVENT NOW!
THATS A GOOD THING!
ARE YOU BLIND?
argh.

Democracy is allowing you to rant, isn't it? Are you reading a book right now? You entire post contradicts your argument. Hint, hint.

junkie christ · Post by **junkie christ** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:32 pm

ophelia wrote:Democracy is allowing you to rant, isn't it? Are you reading a book right now? You entire post contradicts your argument. Hint, hint.

i typed up a huge response to that, but considering i was only posting on the board while taking breaks FROM writing (you picked a bad example, sorry. guess you should learn who your enemy is) and working on a massive website for one of my grad classes... um yea actually i guess you could say im reading a book in a way. and either way, trollers dont deserve responses. sorry.and no, my post FUELS my argument. you just missed the point.
and the ill-informed shall inherit the earth.

ophelia · Post by **ophelia** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:39 pm

junkie christ wrote:
ophelia wrote:Democracy is allowing you to rant, isn't it? Are you reading a book right now? You entire post contradicts your argument. Hint, hint.

i typed up a huge response to that, but considering i was only posting on the board while taking breaks FROM writing (you picked a bad example, sorry. guess you should learn who your enemy is) and working on a massive website for one of my grad classes... um yea actually i guess you could say im reading a book in a way. and either way, trollers dont deserve responses. sorry.and no, my post FUELS my argument. you just missed the point.
and the ill-informed shall inherit the earth.

Enemy? Troller? What is that? If I don't deserve a response, why did you post one? For a grad student you are very confusing.

Aside from all that, and seriously, what are you in grad school for?

Seraph Antaine · Post by **Seraph Antaine** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:47 pm

JaNell wrote:
Seraph Antaine wrote:
Codeine Coma wrote:To whom it may concern....

My previous post was not ment to slam DJ's.If it was taken this way,Forgive me.

I understand where the local DJ's come from...And yes I did support them.(I currently do not because of illnesses.But,if you need my support send me some of your original material and I will pay for it.)
As far as the Black Ball goes...I just want to open people's eyes to what I perceive is going on. And that is...another forum wants you to attend thier function...Yet,in previous statements they have clearly stated that some of you/us are not welcomed. And in previous other statements some added "Why would you want to go,if you were not invited?".

So I have one question for the "other forum"...Why are we all of a sudden deciding to invite all? You say it is not the money...Then tell me what it is? You previously stated that some were not welcomed....So why are they now?

Are you feeling OK? One more time...
The the private forum which may not be named forum is invitation only. Why? So we will have only members who are friends with at least someone on the board. That way, you do not get all the walk-in jackasses, trolling and flaming away, for whom no one can account. This is the only way we can think of to have a board that does not need moderators, something we are quite tired of. The initial list of invitees was limited to people whom we know and like, but was not inclusive of everyone we know and like. Those first members have the right to invite whomever they wish to add to our roster. In turn, the new members invited by them may invite whomever they wish. Whaddya know, it works! We don't have much time wasted in bickering on our board. We can use the time to actually get things done, like the planning of events. Events...
Stay with me buddy. Do you need some oxygen? The event we have organized on the private forum which may not be named has never been invitation-only. Never was anyone told they were not welcome to come. Interestingly, the KGB itself had no problem with our forum, until we announced we had arranged an event without consulting them. Laughable, that, especially in consideration of the fact that two of them are among the first registered members of our board. I guess the Bone being picked here is over who is collecting the cover at the door. There is no sudden change in that we are now inviting all. You do not have to invite people to an open party. You just tell them it is happening. The event, if you can read a flyer, is open to all adults, of at least 18yrs age. If, on the night of Saturday the 27th, you feel that you should abstain from fun, in order to show that you wish only to support KG, rather than support a widening scene, then, by all means stay at home, or go down to Liquid and spend your money there. Or go out of town and patronize someone else's scene. I do not care really what your decision will ultimately be. It is the basis, or fallacy, upon which you decide which bothers me, and that only slightly. I do not know you, and would not recognize you if you showed up. And if you do not show, I will not miss seeing you. There will be many people there whom I will not know, and I doubt any of them will enjoy themselves one bit less for not being a member of the the private forum which may not be named forum.

That answer was a strategic error for many reasons, Tony.

"Or go out of town and patronize someone else's scene."
I was going to PM you about this subject, since I had more thoughts on it, but since you mentioned it, I'll address it here.
The reasons for the raids, from what I've heard:
Meet new people.
Recruit out-of-town people to come play with us in Knoxville.
Get the heck out of Knoxville. Much as I like Knoxville, it gets claustrophobic and everyone needs to get a vacation from it every once in a while.
Roadtrip!

None of those reasons will change if we have a weekly night - a weekly night would be lovely.

I also have some issues with your problems with Ivy's - especially since you were one of the original people going to Skareoke. Ivy's was a dive that usually had a few random rednecks at the bar - so what? The Mercury was a dive, too. I didn't mind sharing club space with rednecks or random people who came in. Some of those people are on the board now. In fact, by the general definition of "Redneck" - which can include people who are rabid sports fans, have high school level education, live in a trailer, like wrestling, race cars or bikes - a lot of people on the board, people that I enjoy the company of, are Rednecks.

Ultimately, I can't support the private forum which may not be named because the private forum which may not be named doesn't support me. As far as I know, the money from Sanctus goes to support the servers and upgrades to keep the KG board going, as well as paying rent on the venues. I'll pay $5 to dance for that diversity. I also should point out that I am not a KG lapdog - I've felt pretty hung out to dry by the KG more than once. I do, however, believe firmly in the original ideal (not idea) of the board - to build a diverse community, an inclusive community, not dependant on your income, or social class, or who has a petty grudge against you.

Where will the money for the private forum which may not be named functions be going? EZ board is free, so it's not going to support the ability to host a board, which, of course, it would make no sense to support even if it did if all the people contributing financially aren't welcome on the board itself. I'd feel exactly the same way if it were a club or board that I qualified for; it's just the principle of the thing.

Ah, JaNell. You really can be tedious. Strategic error...heh. Very dramatic.
1) Ivy's was lame, but I tried to remain enthusiastic, as long as I could, to support the perpetuation of the scene. The rednecks wised-up and aborted it before I did. BTW, by some definitions, I am a redneck, because I love the musclecars. No hypocrite here. No points for you.
2) Server upgrades. Ha...ha. Last time there was a server upgrade was, from what I hear, about a year ago. Anyway, the version of EZboard we use is not free. You have to pay to keep the ads off. We pay for it every 6mos. We also pay monthly and yearly fees for webserver hosting. We'd like to buy another machine for use as a server, so that we can host ourselves, and we'd like to pay someone to engineer a slick forum engine for us, but for now, we have not the funds...alas. 0rlok may spend the rest on booze and hookers. Again, no points for you.
3) Our the private forum which may not be named forum is not perceived by anyone as the total of the Knoxville gothic scene, nor is the KG board, except by a few dim-witted dolts. To claim that the existence of another forum besides KG, as exclusive as it may be, is detrimental to diversity in this scene is supreme hypocrisy. Are you grasping to alchemically create some kind of new phenomenal dichotomy that combines the ideas of monopoly and diversity? Please stop smoking Crystal Plumber. It is hurting your friends and family. Let me put it another way. You are not a member of the Old City Merchants. Will you refuse to buy a drink at BlueCats tomorrow night?

Come if you want. Stay away if you want. It won't bother me. I just hate to sit and let you spin your myth to the audience of my friends here on KG who are not yet members of the private forum which may not be named. I don't want them to hear only your spin. Either way, though, I will still have fun at the Black Ball, drinking beer with the belly dancers.

junkie christ · Post by **junkie christ** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:51 pm

ophelia:
im not, im just already taking the classes because im out of things to take (grad soon). computer science, im an IT guy that programs (strange huh?). if you have a problem with me, pm it to me. dont waste web space here. and again, this is stupid.
thanks for proving my point, this is me on the moral high ground for the first time in my life (see vader im learning :dup:

)
a)enemy- if you have a pulse, im yours and your mine.
b)troller- almost every post you make is bitching. do you know what it is to troll a website?
if your going to try to e-whine at someone, do it at someone who remotely cares about the issue or cares you exist. im in neither range. i usually just tear people to shreds when they annoy me, but ive learned to do it in person, e-bitching is dumb. you have time to retype that oh so clever response. blah. stupid and pointless. now im wondering if my orginial post will get edited out because you took it personally. must have hit a nerve. i really dont care either way.
and my original post wasnt just at you, it was at EVERYONE whining like 6th graders over a new site and a new event.

ReddErin · Post by **ReddErin** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:00 pm

ophelia wrote:
You missed my point, there. The last sentence was sarcasm...coming from me....about being polite...get it now?

I think that there was a discussion going on at the time about, "How can Fiction start a goth night without KG approval?" This was one of my responses, that if they wanted to do a goth night, they probably should have contacted us ahead of time. The reason, as you see I stated, was not that they had to ask permission, but that they could have utilized KG as free advertising and market research. The last point was made somewhere, but I'm not sure that it was posted in that particular thread.

Everyone was up in arms about getting KG approval. I never thought that anyone needed approval for a club night. I just thought that it was stupidity not to get some input from the goths before announcing it...for the owner's benefit and for the people. It was originally going to be a fetish night and was advertised as such. When the owner realized that people didn't want it to be a goth fetish night, he left that alone. Still, it went out on flyers. But, they aren't open anymore, are they? They didn't listen when given advice and ended up making it something like a hip-hop night because people didn't come. One instance, it took almost a month to get rid of the paid dancers, with everyone saying how stupid they thought that was. This could have all been avoided if the owner had spoken to the group first.

No, I didn't speak to the group. I did promotions for Sanctus for over a year....for free. I also did this website for longer than that....for free. I don't need to ask anyone what they want, as I have heard it for a long time now....we want a Saturday night. If you don't, don't support it. If we don't have enough people to support it, it won't happen. We're putting on the party. You're all invited. It does have admission. And, yes, the forum is still...everyone say it together....invitation only. Thanks.

I haven't missed your points. And I am not waging war on your forum or your club night. It doesn't affect my life that much. As far as Sinister goes, I am aware of every aspect of it, since Chris and I have been living together and collaborating from the get-go. There are much bigger issues (leading to its demise) that most people aren't aware of. And Chris and I made it a point to support every other venue, even as I was helping pull a couple of KG knives out of his back. There was no permission asked because there was no time allowed to us by Gary. Period. And our hands were obviously tied in regards to dancers, etc. (And yes, you did promote heavily for Sanctus, even at Sinister, which we were more than happy to let you do).

Saturday night is great. Admission is an obvious factor. What you are failing to understand is that private groups usually promote private functions. Frat parties are for the members, girl scout parties are for the girl scouts. You know as well as everyone that the new forum is not meant to remove drama. You wanted some, you started some. Kudos to you. I think it's all terribly amusing. And please don't think this has anything to do with my being a non-member of the private forum which may not be named, because I really don't care. There was a point when I would have danced on the burning ashes of KnoxGothic. But it doesn't hit that close to home anymore.

I wish you the best in all of your efforts, and that is not sarcasm. However, you have planted a seed, and you are getting the desired results, so why bother to come to this board and post at all? Why be so defensive? If you really don't give a shit, then don't. Host your night, give everyone the finger. I don't understand the point. You are obviously happy in the new niche, why continue the animosity. It's there- good job.

I was just thinking...you know I'm spending all of this time defending the night and the message board...on KG. This is pretty fucked up. I don't even want to post over here. I guess I feel like when people raise questions or accusations, that I have a duty to respond. I may be defending the board, the night, myself, and our members, but I wouldn't say that I'm defensive. I just expect this to keep going indefinetly, and (for reasons unknown to myself) every time someone brings up a question, whether it has been addressed or not yet, I feel like it needs to be answered because I'm one of the people involved in this night and this board. I think I did the same for KG awhile back...spent a lot of time on the forum answering the same question over and over again. This all seems very familiar.

Anyway, I have no cream for my coffee, and now have a headache from caffeine withdrawal. My husband and I are going to stop by the coffee house for a minute, and then go flyer for the rest of the evening. We hope to see....nevermind....I just...don't...care. People will come, I'm sure of that. Oh, and the message board, ya, still invitation only. I'm thinking of changing my sig to read this.

Any more nits to pick...I'll be back this evening.

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:09 pm

junkie christ wrote:e-bitching is dumb.

The problem as I see it is that you aren't acknowledging that what Ophelia is saying is that what you are doing is also e-bitching. This is an argument that pops up on every Internet message forum about every few months, at least. The unresolved question is: Is e-bitching about e-bitching more or less dumb than e-bitching itself - or are they merely equally dumb?

I honestly think that bitching about bitching is dumb. I don't think you're a dumb person at all, JC, so I can only assume it's your youthful vigor that fuels these rants.

(Obligatory self-analysis: Is what I'm doing the biggest waste of time of all? Use the back of the paper if you need more room.)

junkie christ · Post by **junkie christ** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:20 pm

Jack wrote:
junkie christ wrote:e-bitching is dumb.

The problem as I see it is that you aren't acknowledging that what Ophelia is saying is that what you are doing is also e-bitching. This is an argument that pops up on every Internet message forum about every few months, at least. The unresolved question is: Is e-bitching about e-bitching more or less dumb than e-bitching itself - or are they merely equally dumb?

I honestly think that bitching about bitching is dumb. I don't think you're a dumb person at all, JC, so I can only assume it's your youthful vigor that fuels these rants.

(Obligatory self-analysis: Is what I'm doing the biggest waste of time of all? Use the back of the paper if you need more room.)

i know, i was trying to prove the point that the argument was stupid. didnt really see i too was bitching, good point jack. thx.
and its not so much vigor as it is well read and researched hatred... hehe! ohohoh! check the TSOL for gov thread. youll get a kick outta it.

JaNell · Post by **JaNell** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:42 pm

junkie christ wrote:all these major world issues right now

I don't think that fighting for major world issues absolves you from standing up for what you think is right locally, in any case.

Nexxus23 · Post by **Nexxus23** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 2:49 pm

JaNell wrote:I don't think that fighting for major world issues absolves you from standing up for what you think is right locally, in any case.

Think globally, act locally.

Hardcoregirl · Post by **Hardcoregirl** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 3:16 pm

Wow, so apparently its a crime to say, "hey this here's going on in this boring town, please come" and still not want to invite some people to the v.i.p. room. Sorry guys...it's been going on FOREVER, move on with your lives. We don't have locked threads, or deleted threads or banned members. We don't have prepubescent mansonites threatening the lives of our members, or dramawhores arguing a subject into the ground. It's a lovely peaceful place where all get along pretty damn well, and we discuss ways of making things better in this town and try to encourage each other in positive ways and spread news about things we each might be interested in. Tell me now, why is this bad? It's not...you are just jealous because you must sleep in the drama filled bed you have made...Please, by all means, go start a board and don't invite me. Pretty please? A public forum can do a lot for a community, but things are getting a little too big and a little too commercial and you have to wonder who is in it simply for the $$$. If me and my friends are continually badgered for not wanting to have to deal with morons and any person off the street who dresses like the Crow...I'll take my support elsewere. I have supported KG since the beginning and will continue to, unless it is shown that a nice idea like knoxgothic has been fucked in the ass by people such as those who won't just LET IT FUCKING GO.

I've been going to Sanctus since the first one, and I've been on this board for over a year and a half I believe...I think two or so months after it got up and running. I've supported every event I could possibly afford to, and have seen a lot of shit go down in this time period. I've handed ALOT more money over to these events than some of you assclowns who feel like you can come out from under your rocks and talk shit.

You guys are shining examples of why an invite only forum is a wonderful thing. I personally, do not like to associate with morons, however, if there is something public going on, I feel they have just as much right to be there as I do...and I don't see any problem in advertising it. People will say and do a lot of things behind their monitors that they wouldn't do in public, so they should be allowed to be entertained as much as the next person. I think if we had any doubt that you all could act like grownups and enjoy an evening out...we *wouldn't* invite you.

It's gonna be a kick ass party whether you are there or not. Really, if you feel shafted..by all means..please don't come. I was in fact thinking of someway I could compensate some of you for NOT coming.

But, KarlaBOO is djing and if you don't want to support Karla, you can suck my left ovary. And die.

Codeine Coma · Post by **Codeine Coma** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 3:49 pm

::Crawls back underneth his rock and hits the oxygen mask one more time::

::Grunting along the way"I know when to give up. Damned Kids!"::

::As he lingers in the shadow of the Black Ball,and realizing most have been black balled,He thinks to himself. "Dress up like the Crow?"::

Hahahaha!

:okfucktard:

X · Post by X » Sat Sep 20, 2003 4:14 pm

god if you don't live here, you just get lost in the 938239042834 posts that follows yours.

OKAY...

so, the reasoning behind me not supporting the Sinister gimmick, was simply well....one, it was a weekday- two, it had the same talent in everyweek and thrice- i knew a) how big the place was b) what their usual numbers were and....*and obviously you among others found out* C how big of an assclown the owner was.

NOW with that being said, i don't think i had anything TRUELY bad to say about the place or the night...i think i was the first one to say anything negative, and it was the opinions of apparently a lot of the viewers of this said board....since after i made said original post ALOT of people bought me drinks with congrats being thrown at me. The point is, i don't remember what i said.....since it was more than a year ago, and i have more important things to do with my time than backtracking and re-reading what i did say.

The point is, all of my forecasting was correct. NO..? well the only thing i was wrong about is, i believe i gave it 3 months, i think it went 4.

the differences here.......

1. its a weekend night, which means everything will be harder to provide.....BUT it also means more people can make it out. i know of 25 people already who can make it out to a weekend night, that could not to said weekday night.

2. again from what i understand the talent will be rotating, which means well....i guess orlok is like a box of chocolates....blah blah blah what you get........

3. there is actual TALK, and WANT....and not to mention ADVERTISEMENT- of which Erin is the queen of-

to seal this argument, i'll also state something that probably isn't really well known.....just to put this whole anti sinister, cus i'm not part of it, or whatever to waste....

80s night.....i said EARLY that it wouldn't last as a weekly.....Now fact of the matter is, we will never really know. But i know the week before the 2nd to last week *when we announced the shutdown* that Diamond talked to me about bringing it down to once a month, perhaps, bi weekly. I was part of that, i knew from the 2nd week it wouldn't work as a weekly...there were several reasons....but- that disclaims your argument moreless in total there.

Its not cus i have a part in the show......allthought that certinly helps *rolls eyes* its the fact that, all the dominos are in line....or- the moons are lined up....or whatever silly thing you want to say.

the point is, as said, be there if you want....don't go if you think its dumb. The bottom line is it will work. There are enough people who want to have fun, that will make up for the neighsayers.

Hardcoregirl · Post by **Hardcoregirl** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 4:28 pm

Codeine Coma wrote:::Crawls back underneth his rock and hits the oxygen mask one more time::

::Grunting along the way"I know when to give up. Damned Kids!"::

::As he lingers in the shadow of the Black Ball,and realizing most have been black balled,He thinks to himself. "Dress up like the Crow?"::

Hahahaha!

Because I have respect for Mo, I'm gonna let this go...But please don't work to get on my bad side...I'd rather not upset her by argueing with you.

Nemesis · Post by **Nemesis** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 4:46 pm

Buttercup wrote:Because I have respect for Mo, I'm gonna let this go...But please don't work to get on my bad side...I'd rather not upset her by argueing with you.

Wuss....