Can't we all just...

X · Post by X » Thu Jan 15, 2004 11:21 pm

but i never claimed i did, now did i?

noless, the point was made. and i am actually on your side with the non masterfull album, his best work yes...but not as good as Love Gun godamnit

rec|use · Post by **rec|use** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 11:28 pm

i think i can back up my own opinions without outside support

thanks

Post by **Arkady** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 12:19 am

rec|use wrote:
you fail

and i remember about 4 kids in town that listened to industrial music
and you weren't one of them

I suggest you tone it down.

rec|use · Post by **rec|use** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 12:43 am

tone it down?

i didnt even attack the kid

what is wrong

rec|use · Post by **rec|use** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 12:50 am

One of the other reason’s it’s masterful is the fact that it was an artistic and direct response to all of the church based organizations that at the time were trying “raise awareness” about this and other “demonically influenced” music to the point of censorship.

if pissing off a bunch of christians is masterful
than i'm goddamn da vinci

the themes were childish
and have been run into the ground by every shock rock band ever
again the duality of man concept is ages old
and has been expressed better by other artists imo

as far as nothing ever sounding like it
i suggest you go back and dig up other records in the time period
if i go back and listen again i could probably point you out some points of reference they borrowed from

one right off the top of my head is the drum beat from the beautiful people is ripped right off from x marks the pedwalk fascist smash

X · Post by X » Fri Jan 16, 2004 1:36 am

here is a personal attack.....

you're an assclown.....

and you can quote me

i wasn't backing up your opinion, because it is yours..which are usually like you, living in coolness for the moment. I stated mine, and simply said back the fuck up.

so...thank you not so much....you're welcome even less

Post by **Arkady** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 3:50 pm

X wrote:here is a personal attack.....

you're an assclown.....

and you can quote me

i wasn't backing up your opinion, because it is yours..which are usually like you, living in coolness for the moment. I stated mine, and simply said back the fuck up.

so...thank you not so much....you're welcome even less

Tone it down.

X · Post by X » Fri Jan 16, 2004 4:13 pm

see arkady doesn't take sides

gray · Post by **gray** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 9:11 am

Ok wait a minute here. This argument is foolish.

1 - No one in the argument is a professional studio sound engineer.

2 - No one in the argument has the educational background in music history to proclaim or refute either point of view.

3 - Even if anyone in the argument had the above credentials (I could be wrong but I really think we should be more humble about this), this still boils down to a matter of opinion.

The only way to assess music is to assess it for yourself. The moment you start trying to prove your opinionon the matter to others you are going to get your feelings hurt. There is a similar problem in every realm of art, be it music, painting or even literature.

Jason's says Antichrist Superstar is masterful for his own reasons. Recluse says Antichrist Superstar it isn't masterful for his own reasons. There is no right or wrong answer.

However that said, consider this possibilty. People accross the world devise a method of assessing and judging music on its individual merits. Each piece of music is then studied and reviewed and picked apart in to every little minute detail. Entire thesis are written on the qualities within a single artist's work. Other individuals quantify and attempt to qualify their own arguments for and against the same artist in an attempt to create objectivity in the assessment process. Now you have to read and research other peoples papers and publications on this artist's aforementioned qualities and then decide whether or not the artist is 'masterful'.

Sounds like a lot of nonesense doesn't it? Well it is, and that is why trying to study music can be a rediculous pain in the ass. Chances are you are not going to agree with everyone elses point of view. Why? Because music as with any artform is completely subjective. So quit arguing about it. It doesn't help either person in the long run.

Post by **darkvader** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 10:47 am

My first impression of Manson went pretty much like this:

"Who's screwed up the Eurythmics?"

Which is not to say that I hate Manson. I'm not a huge fan, but I'm not going to run screaming from the room because it gets played.

rec|use · Post by **rec|use** » Sun Jan 18, 2004 10:27 pm

No one in the argument is a professional studio sound engineer.

2 - No one in the argument has the educational background in music history to proclaim or refute either point of view.

<--- associates of audio science degree full sail grad 98
- which includes
audio engineering techniques in the studio
and in live sound
- audio post production
- studio mix
- live mix
- show production
- assist engineer
- music history
- entertainment law

and more
http://www.fullsail.com

1 year asst. engineer at f7 sound and vision in tampa fl
http://www.f7sound.com

most recently
asst live sound and monitor engineer (and main eng when the eng is on the road)
/ dj / booker and promoter for the liars club in tampa
doing sound for national and local acts
including
das ich
bile
the independents
flat stanley
bozo porno circus
christian death
grim faeries
terrorfakt
nocturne
inertia
negative format
malevolent creation
unholy ghost
black witchery
revenge
and a fuckin ton more
from punk to metal to industrial to what ever

3 years formal music lessons outside of fullsail guitar and piano
6 years label owner (http://www.ncc-records.com)
aprox 2 years live sound engineer
two of my own records released working on no. 3 and 4 as we speak
and have been recording music since around 96 some couple of years unformal as i was still in highschool

i hope that is enough experience for you to validate my opinion

pryjmaty · Post by **pryjmaty** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 5:12 pm

Your opinion is your opinion....needs no validating. Just cause others do not agree with your opinion does not make your opinion any less valuable. Your credentials, while impressive, do not make your opinion "the shit". The world would be an exceedingly boring place if we all shared the same opinion.

rec|use · Post by **rec|use** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:37 pm

i never said my word is law
i agree that we all have the right to our opinion

the comment was that none of us should argue about it becaue none of us had the credentials

i'm simply backing my opinion up based upon this comment
and my opinions of mr manson are not also an opinion about any of you who like manson
i don't know a lot of you
and i certainly can't pass judgement on you because you disagree with me

and a correction to that
fullsail grad 99 not 98

junkie christ · Post by **junkie christ** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:45 pm

arguing on the internet is dumb

rec|use · Post by **rec|use** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:53 pm

here is a present for you
http://www.dhrshop.co.uk/nwo/index.html

Post by **Arkady** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 11:59 pm

rec|use wrote:here is a present for you
http://www.dhrshop.co.uk/nwo/index.html

I actually liked that a whole lot.

rec|use · Post by **rec|use** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 12:15 am

me too
i've liked alec and the the whole dhr gang for years

gray · Post by **gray** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 9:40 am

rec|use wrote:<--- associates of audio science degree full sail grad 98
- which includes
audio engineering techniques in the studio
and in live sound
- audio post production
- studio mix
- live mix
- show production
- assist engineer
- music history
- entertainment law

and more
http://www.fullsail.com

1 year asst. engineer at f7 sound and vision in tampa fl
http://www.f7sound.com

most recently
asst live sound and monitor engineer (and main eng when the eng is on the road)
/ dj / booker and promoter for the liars club in tampa
doing sound for national and local acts
including
das ich
bile
the independents
flat stanley
bozo porno circus
christian death
grim faeries
terrorfakt
nocturne
inertia
negative format
malevolent creation
unholy ghost
black witchery
revenge
and a fuckin ton more
from punk to metal to industrial to what ever

3 years formal music lessons outside of fullsail guitar and piano
6 years label owner (http://www.ncc-records.com)
aprox 2 years live sound engineer
two of my own records released working on no. 3 and 4 as we speak
and have been recording music since around 96 some couple of years unformal as i was still in highschool

i hope that is enough experience for you to validate my opinion

Hmm... point made and nice resume. You should really change the 'htp://' in your sig file to 'http://' . It doesn't work currently.

thanks

rec|use · Post by **rec|use** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 10:07 am

thanks for the kind words

You should really change the 'htp://' in your sig file to 'http://' . It doesn't work currently

good lookin out
i just woke up
but i'll fix it today

sic_fuck · Post by **sic_fuck** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 6:58 pm

Though common sense says this will get me flamed by people who will blow pseudo-intellectual gobbledy guk up my ass. My being a maggot will not allow me to pass this up.

I refute the notion, statement, or ideation that Slipknot is nu-metal. Slipknot is a well-oiled industrialized thrashcore experience of raw hatred. Sure it's full of angst, sure it's a "high school thing" but I am yet to see 9 other motherfuckers as talented as them put out such a production of pure personal hell. And in referrence to the article. Mansonites,Maggots, Juggalos, Mud people, all fall under the same category to the sohpistogoth. I've met people with the IQ of a fucking genital wort who looked down on me because I listen to Slipknot and they listen to Bauhaus. Sorry I'm not all for sitting around under a blacklight smoking a clove and bitching and moaning about slitting my wrist horizontally 'cause I did it for sympathy and noone fucking understands me. I don't know if that made sense or not, I don't really give a fuck. I hate this high school mantality that punks,goths,etc. NEVER fucking evolve out of. "If you don't know GG Allen your not punk" music has less than shit to do with punk. "If you don't listen to Bauhaus you're not goth." You arn't either where the fuck were you when Rome got ass raped?! Either way most people in this or that or whatever fucking subculture need to get the fuck over themselves and realize they are people, just like Joe Preppypants. If you're going to treat someone like shit do it for a good reason, like because they are a fucking person, and not because of the music they do or do not listen to!

-END-
</maggot mode>