"Some Say ICP Fans Part of a Religious Cult"

Mother Mo · Post by **Mother Mo** » Thu Dec 30, 2004 11:32 pm

sinful_fetish wrote: I am actually surprised that a number of people on this list are so against this scene. I know I hated it when I was made fun of because I walked in a different circle than the norm. I guess I just expected more open mindedness from the scene I love.....

I've had that same disappointing experience a few times. Sucks, but that's the way it is. I find it best to just agree to disagree sometimes.

Mercurygriffin · Post by **Mercurygriffin** » Thu Dec 30, 2004 11:39 pm

I have been down for a whlie and I on the other hand am not so surprised that this scene hates us. What more could you expect from a bunch of pasty faced goths who have nothing better to do than to pick apart anothers personality and poke them with the "flaws" they see. I don't own a single ICP/ Twizted/ Dark Lotus/ Blaze/ esham/ ABK shirt nor will I ever. I don't shoplift because it hurts the economy. I have met what I refer to as juggalos who haven't even heard of psychopathic records. In my opinion a juggalo is someone who just doesn't give a fuck what others think about them. I don't mean that as they let shit roll of their back. I mean that as they don't care either way what your opinion of them is, they remain the same person. I admit that most of the juggalos out there who shout it out loud most of the time could use some etiquite but not all of us do that. I have known people for years who had no idea that I consider myself a juggalo. Some of us are quiet about it. Some of us are very intelligent and some of us even have degrees. Just because you run into a loud ass Hatchet Ryder doen't mean that we are all loud. So to end this:

Mass murder makes me happy
Dead bodies make me happy
Say what you will of me
We'll always have Juggalo Family!

Wicked_Carnie · Post by **Wicked_Carnie** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:02 am

i really can't believe that this is now about ripping on other people because of differences. i thought i was coming to a place where diversity and originality is the only rule.
what shocks me more is that more people aren't kind of pissed about this. i, among other 'juggalos', help support this scene every week i have respect for everyone here, no matter how different they are, and some people here could take a fucking lesson. i just think we could grow up a little,

forgive me
carnie

Hardcoregirl · Post by **Hardcoregirl** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:08 am

Mercurygriffin wrote: So to end this:

Mass murder makes me happy
Dead bodies make me happy
Say what you will of me
We'll always have Juggalo Family!

I'm sorry, mass murder isn't cool. The Oklahoma City bombings, 9/11, the tate labianca murders...none of them were "cool" , sorry.

Neither are dead bodies in particular...at least not in the context which I think they mean.

I think this mentality is ignorant, and sorry, if there's one thing I'm intolerant of its ignorance.

And the only experience I have with juggalo's is those that frequent hot topic, so perhaps these jewels of intelligence and culture are out there waiting for me to happen upon them like fresh blooms in the spring, but I kinda fucking doubt it.

I'm sorry, I'm gonna pick on rascists, homophobes, or people who think violence and violent death are particularly cool, or anyone else with an opinion that is ignorant (and this is not because its different from mine). As an anthropologist, I view this subculture as nothing but one akin to something like the KKK or any other group of those who believe in such moronic things.

Not caring about what people think is one thing, but the way these people are total clones of one another makes me think that they do care ALOT about what their fellow juggalo's think or they wouldn't buy the fucking uniform. They are simply conformists, no different that all the abercrombie kids except with a thuggish uniform that I suppose is more affordable to the lower class.

(Oh, and by the way I am of the lower class and I wouldn't label myself "gothic" either nor could you pigeonhole me into any subculture by the clothes I wear daily)

I have a couple friends who like ICP, but I don't grasp that anymore than I grasp why some people like Marilyn Manson, but we are all entitled to different opinions. I'm just glad those friends of mine don't DEFINE themselves by one band they like.

This is just my less than popular opinion and usual...don't take offense...

Hardcoregirl · Post by **Hardcoregirl** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:16 am

Wicked_Carnie wrote:i really can't believe that this is now about ripping on other people because of differences. i thought i was coming to a place where diversity and originality is the only rule.
what shocks me more is that more people aren't kind of pissed about this. i, among other 'juggalos', help support this scene every week i have respect for everyone here, no matter how different they are, and some people here could take a fucking lesson. i just think we could grow up a little,

forgive me
carnie

I don't have any problem with you personally, or any jugallo for that matter personally. Props for supporting the scene, a lot of us have been doing it for years now...And there are no rules really. Everyone and anyone is welcome. Just because some of us don't like certain people in groups doesn't mean as individuals we would dislike them. I'm just not sure how much ICP really fits into goth, and honestly, I can't say I'd want to be associated with the group if it became a group that largely condoned violence.

Just because these are the opinions of me and a couple of others doesn't mean that by and large the majority doesn't disagree. I'm not here to win any fucking popularity contest, fo' sho'.

I may respect you as a person, but I have yet to meet anyone I respect as a juggalo.

The majority of people here will love and accept you no matter what, however, some of us are a little more selective when it comes to general mentality.

tat2jay · Post by **tat2jay** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:33 am

its a band
a friggin band
love em
hate em
whatever
i dont judge people on the music they listen to
people are more complex than that
the thing is, if you like it, power to you
if you hate it, cool with me
but why argue about it? its not politics or religion (i dont understand why people argue about that either instead of discussion)

IN MY OPINION:
we are a collection of people that are basicly the outcasts of regular society - i know a few of these ICP fans, and they have all been uber cool to me
but that is a small sample
i am afraid buttercup has met with the less than desirables of that crowd, which sucks -
i hate it when i get compared to , say, the general atlanta goths, or LA goths or whoever is NOT a knox goth, cuz they are not like me.
does that make sense?
my point is, we are a familiy, like it or not,
get pissed when someone doesnt like your political choice, but dont stress so much over the music -
that being said, everyone may now attack the hell out of me for being totally in love with XTC and They Might Be Giants
carry on

Hardcoregirl · Post by **Hardcoregirl** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:39 am

Please don't any of you take this personally, it just like me and judas arguing about Bush or politics...different opinions is all...

I detest Bush supporters, but I love judas

I detest juggalo's but Abreeskye is one cool ass chick, so's this kid I work with, even though he hangs out with idiots.

B_Ko · Post by **B_Ko** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:40 am

tat2jay wrote:...They Might Be Giants...

Ray+Wendy · Post by **Ray+Wendy** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:42 am

tat2jay wrote:...XTC ...

Andy Partridge rocks!!!!
:cat:

:cat:

Mercurygriffin · Post by **Mercurygriffin** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:52 am

It pains me to say this but I think buttercup hates me. That makes me sad. And all this time I just thought I annoyed her. Guess that means that is one more in the "people who don't really know me" catagory.

The Stormstress · Post by **The Stormstress** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:55 am

ICP generally amuzez me ... Good 4 a laff & 2 reliev a lil' stress & aggression ... Sum peepz just take this shit WAY 2 seriously! (on both sidez)

tat2jay · Post by **tat2jay** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:57 am

triple bill
ICP
XTC
TMBG

hell yeah
you know im not alone on this!!!

punkrockjoe · Post by **punkrockjoe** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 3:55 am

Crack circles under J's eye's unheard of...of course this is also a forum who loves a guy called JUNKIE CHRIST so Im not to worried...as far as juggalos being dumbasses...well I'll be the first to admit Ive met some stupid people who happen to be sporting psycho gear but Ive also seen some funny hot topic goths too...and pseudo punks so this is obviously not just us ninjas..it's just convienent to point at them when you want to get down on something...I think people miss that there fucking off and letting us blow off some steam with the humor and violence...it's like when people assume Alice Cooper is the same off stage and on...it's an act to let us get out some agression and laugh a little...some kids take it too seriously..I understand that...I hate to say it but I have talked to some goths who take their shit way too seriously as well...some people need something to prop themselves up on because they lack confidence..I also think that when you get past all that theyre also saying something...you might not like it but there is a message...anyone who has came from a tough time in life understands some of the things there saying...and understand the need for the escape...but either way theirs alot of us out there who support it so it probably best to just agree to disagree

Hardcoregirl · Post by **Hardcoregirl** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 7:51 am

Mercurygriffin wrote:It pains me to say this but I think buttercup hates me. That makes me sad. And all this time I just thought I annoyed her. Guess that means that is one more in the "people who don't really know me" catagory.

Can't say I hate you at all...you've always been polite to me, and hating you would require more energy than I'm willing to give...lol. Some of the things you say on here I disagree with, but again, you seem like a nice guy.

Reverend_ Hate · Post by **Reverend_ Hate** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 8:28 am

punkrockjoe wrote:Crack circles under J's eye's unheard of...of course this is also a forum who loves a guy called JUNKIE CHRIST so Im not to worried...as far as juggalos being dumbasses...well I'll be the first to admit Ive met some stupid people who happen to be sporting psycho gear but Ive also seen some funny hot topic goths too...and pseudo punks so this is obviously not just us ninjas..it's just convienent to point at them when you want to get down on something...I think people miss that there fucking off and letting us blow off some steam with the humor and violence...it's like when people assume Alice Cooper is the same off stage and on...it's an act to let us get out some agression and laugh a little...some kids take it too seriously..I understand that...I hate to say it but I have talked to some goths who take their shit way too seriously as well...some people need something to prop themselves up on because they lack confidence..I also think that when you get past all that theyre also saying something...you might not like it but there is a message...anyone who has came from a tough time in life understands some of the things there saying...and understand the need for the escape...but either way theirs alot of us out there who support it so it probably best to just agree to disagree

I fuckin love this guy.You beat me to saying just about everything I was thinking while reading this thread.Those who know me know that I proudly call myself a Juggalo.Dealing with a lot of the shit I have dealt with for years,I have a huge appreciation for the release that the Psychopathic Records music offers.I think that listening to these comical depictions of murder and violence goes a long way to prevent ME from picking up and axe and losing it on a lot of motha fuckers.

But seriously,it's just music and it all comes down to individual choice and it is completely childish to bash an entire group of people,both in this country and in many others,because some people in that group are fuck heads.Not to mention ignorant and hypocritical.But then again,like Joe said,we can all just agree to disagree.

Getting back to the origional topic of this thread,it is rediculous to call Juggalos a "cult".A family,yes,but not a cult.So to all my Juggalos who are reading this,you know I love you.And for anyone who took the time to voice their opinion in a thoughtful manner,whether I agree with it or not,I love you all too.A little controversy is always a good thing.

judas gnb · Post by **judas gnb** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 10:10 am

people hate my music but i never ever get up in arms about it simply put icp to me are funny in small doses like i can listen to an icp song once in a while but i wont be out buying albums
and like jay says its a frickin band

Mercurygriffin · Post by **Mercurygriffin** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:17 pm

Buttercup wrote:
Mercurygriffin wrote:It pains me to say this but I think buttercup hates me. That makes me sad. And all this time I just thought I annoyed her. Guess that means that is one more in the "people who don't really know me" catagory.

Can't say I hate you at all...you've always been polite to me, and hating you would require more energy than I'm willing to give...lol. Some of the things you say on here I disagree with, but again, you seem like a nice guy.

Well, in that case I recant my former statment. You may be a bit of a grammer nazi and you may be very opinionated witha lack of tact, but you do bring up some very valid points most of the time.

On a side note:

I see that most of our differances come from the differances in the subcultures that we are apart of. The music that moves you has much to do with the attitudes you convey. Some like the older more ambiant goth music , and some like the newer darkness with heavy bass and heavy beats. Some people go to the club to socialize and some go to dance their asses off. I can't afford to flip out and do something violent and stupid so I focus that on the dance floor. All people are the sum of their parts and I don't expect anyone to be swayed to my thought process. I just want everybody to have fun. I don't care if you like this person or if hate this other person. Forget them and do your thing. Sorry had to rant on that. Been on my mind for a while.

Hardcoregirl · Post by **Hardcoregirl** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:36 pm

Mercurygriffin wrote:
Well, in that case I recant my former statment. You may be a bit of a grammer nazi and you may be very opinionated witha lack of tact, but you do bring up some very valid points most of the time.

I have plenty of tact in situations in which I care not to offend people, which this is not one of them.

Grammar nazi..nah, maybe spelling, but even my spelling is worsening with age...I just find it important for people to know what the hell one is trying to say...

"Tact is for people not witty enough to be sarcastic"

vicious_blood · Post by **vicious_blood** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:40 pm

I have to agree with Jay on the whole "it's just a band" thing. And I have to agree with Buttercup on a few things, too.

But for real you guys. If you're juggalos or whatever you wanna call yourselfs, then who cares what people say/think/do about you. Actually, that can go for anyone, not just juggalos.

I honestly don't that people dissing music that you love and have a passion for should make you stress out so flippin much. I mean, it's just one persons oppinion, wether you like it or not, you don't ever have to deal with that person ever again if you dont want to.

Just like anyone who knows anything about me knows that I LOVE (that being an understatement) Rancid. If people diss them , I might be like 'Hey!" but in the long run it doesn't matter. If people don't like them, then they don't have to listen to them. Just like if I don't like what you have to say about them, then I don't have to listen to you.

Anyways, I guess my point is...well I'm not sure I had one.
But don't let it get you all upset and everything. Just chill.

But I do respect the fact that you are that passionate about your music.

karmakaze · Post by **karmakaze** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:09 pm

just to point out, i didn't make and insulting comments on the music. its music. asides from the fact that i despise rap music, i can just not listen to it. however many (many as in, not all) people that i meet who call themselves "juggalos" annoyed me to one degree or another. they seem to tend to be all talk and immature. since some of you are juggalos and do seem to be intelligent then i am sure you have experienced this as well. i am by all means not a pacifist. nor do i have to problem with music about violence for entertainment purposes only. or properly directed violence for that matter. the whole juggalo thing has been so overdone and there does not seem to be much variance in the mentality. its just not creative to me. i can be a badass without listening to any particular band. music does not make you a badass. plus the "juggalo" look tends to lean on the tacky side rather than the tasteful side. and that means allot coming from a guy who wears a hippie skirt.

now to make this clear, there isn't anyone on this board at the moment who i have any issues with. i actually own several ICP cds. (purely coincidence, i have just not gotten rid of them yet, i did give the music a try though) I even have the old ones before they changed color schemes. and i honestly don't get it. explain the who "juggalo" thing to me, in detail, and maybe it won't be such an annoyance the next time i am confronted by one.